When discussing whether or not baptism is essential for salvation, many will cite the penitent thief on the cross as an example of someone who was saved without baptism. Almost inevitably, the person who objects to the essentiality of baptism will ask, “What about the thief on the cross? He was not baptized.” Please notice the following points regarding the forgiven thief on the cross:

Can one be so sure that this thief was never baptized? - Multitudes had come to John from all surrounding areas to be baptized of him: “Then went out to him Jerusalem, and all Judea, and all the region round about Jordan, And were baptized of him in Jordan…” (Matthew 3:5, 6). John obviously had baptized a great number of people, but Jesus’ disciples had baptized even more people than John (John 4:1, 2). Is it not possible that the thief could have been among these great numbers of people who were baptized? From the very words of the thief we infer that he had been taught about the coming kingdom (Luke 23:42), and the kingdom is exactly what John, Jesus, and the disciples had been preaching during the time of these baptisms (Matthew 3:2, 4:17, 10:7). This is further evidence that he very well may have been baptized. It should also be noted that the Bible teaches that it is quite possible to sin again after one has been baptized for the remission of sins (Acts 8:18-24; 1 John 1:8). This thief could have committed a theft after his baptism. It is very presumptuous to claim that this thief had never been baptized.

Can one be so sure that the thief was not born into a covenant relationship with God? - This thief apparently lived and died in Palestine, which is strong evidence that this man was a Jew. The Romans did not crucify their own citizens, so we know that he was not a Roman. If the thief was a Jew, then he was born into a covenant relationship with God, and had been a child of God all his life. If that was the case, this was not an alien sinner who became a child of God on the cross! He would have been an erring child of God seeking forgiveness, which would mean that this account cannot be used today as an example of how a person can become a child of God!

The thief was forgiven while living under a different covenant – We live under the New Testament, which was not established until after the death of Christ: “For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth” (Hebrews 9:16, 17). With the aforementioned Scriptures in mind, please consider the example of a family inheritance – a person’s will is not put into effect until the death of that person. Robert R. Taylor, Jr. noted that “While yet alive he [the testator] may do with his estate as he pleases. But subsequent to death his estate is totally subjected to the ways of his will.” After death the will becomes effective, and one must do what is specified in the will to receive the inheritance. The Will of Christ was not in effect when the thief was forgiven because Christ had not died yet – the New Testament had not been established. The thief was forgiven under a different covenant; thus this account does not apply to us today!

Jesus often forgave sins at His discretion while on Earth – While Jesus was on Earth, He personally forgave certain people’s sins (Luke 5:20), but Jesus does not appear to us in person today and tell us that our sins are forgiven! Remember that before the Testator died He would do with His estate as He pleased (forgive sins at His discretion), but after His death the Will became effective (Hebrews 9:17), and one must now do what is specified in the Will to receive the inheritance. The New Testament Will says that we must now believe and obey the Gospel to purify our souls, avoid eternal punishment, and receive the inheritance (1 Peter 1:22; 2 Thessalonians 1:8; 1 Peter 1:4).

The thief on the cross cannot be used as an example of how someone can become a child of God today. No person alive today is living under the same conditions as this thief was. When one studies how people were converted after the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ, it is clear that those who wished to become children of God were never instructed to pray, nor to merely “invite Jesus into their hearts,” as many would have us do today. In the book of Acts the consistent recording of water baptism in conversion accounts is practically overwhelming, and the results which follow baptism reveal its divine purpose. Obviously baptism is a vital part of God’s Plan for saving man, and is necessary “for the remission of sins” (Acts 2:38).

Jason Hilburn

Hi Jason,
I like all of your points. Very insightful. I have always used the third point that you made to explain the situation with the theif. I'm glad now I have some other biblical evidence to add to this argument.

Thanks!
Mike

Consider this story I once heard during a Gospel Meeting... Abraham Lincoln never paid one dime in income taxes. Let's suppose you write a letter to the IRS telling them that you are not going to pay anymore income taxes because Abraham Lincoln never paid one dime in income taxes. You advise them that they have received your last check. No doubt you will receive a swift letter back from the IRS informing you that in view of the fact that Abraham Lincoln was never under an income tax law... in view of the fact that he lived and died before there ever was an income tax law... he could not have paid income taxes had he wanted to pay income taxes. We will be expecting your check by return mail.

If we can understand this analogy then we ought not have any problem understanding why the thief on the cross did not have to be baptized under the baptism of the Great Commission. The thief on the cross lived prior to the Great Commission while we live under the Great Commission. The thief on the cross lived before the consumation of the gospel of Christ... there is no possible way he could have obeyed the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ even had he wanted to.

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In Christ,
brother Sonnie

It does'nt matter if The Thief On The Cross was baptized or not,
because he lived and died before Christ commanded Baptism
(as one of the steps, in the plan of salvation) for the whole world
(Matt 28:19, 20; and Mark 16:16).


(1) Listen To God Closely, Carefully, And Often, So You Can Develop
The Right Kind Of Faith--A Faith That Finishes What It Starts And Sticks
Only With What The Bible Says (Rom 10:17).

(2) Believe, By Willingly Taking Every Step Necessary(Commanded)
To Be Saved (John 3:16).

(3) Don't Just Feel Sorry For Wrong Doing, But Actually Determine To Stop Doing It
Right Now, And Start Doing What God Says Is Right (Luke 13:3)!

(4) Start Letting People Know You Believe In Jesus By What You Do And Say
(Matt 10:32, 33).

(5) Don't Let Any Thief(ON THE CROSS, OR OFF!!), Steal Your Salvation, By Telling You
Water Baptism Doesn't Save, When The Bible CLEARLY SAYS IT DOES
(1 Pet 3:20, 21; Mark 16:16)!!!

I have an article I wrote on the thief on the cross. It is published here:

http://preachersfiles.com/about-the-thief-on-the-cross/

My quick response to this is that it is not possible today to be saved before Jesus died on the cross.

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"My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth. And hereby we know that we are of the truth, and shall assure our hearts before him." 1 John 3:18-19

The church of Christ at Granby

Very good posts! Excellent!

I had this very issue come up in our High School class a few weeks ago. The answer for me regarding the Thief has always been Luke 5:20-26. Here we learn that Jesus does indeed have the authority to forgive sins. In fact, if you read that passage closely, you will also see that Jesus makes his claim to be divine as well!

From Luke 23:43 we can know for certain that the Thief had his sins forgive because he was told By Jesus that he would be with him in Paradise. Paradise is the part of the Hadean realm where those who die in a "right relationship" with God go (See Luke chapter 19). Jesus assures the Thief that he will go to paradise and thus, we see Jesus doing what he had done in Luke 5:20-26- forgiving sins.

Brotherly,
Don

__________________
Don Gelles,
Preacher, Church of Christ in Hyde Park
Austin, Texas
www.hydeparkcoc.org

My responses:

The way to God is not the "Burger King" way...it is the way of God and if we do it the like He wants it done, then we will get there!

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Romans 16:16 1 Thess. 5:17 1 Thess. 5:22 1 Tim. 6:12 2 Tim 2:15

After Jesus spoke to the rich young ruler about salvation, the disciples seamingly exasperated, exclaimed, "who then can be saved". Jesus replied, "with men this is impossible but with God all things are possible". Getting dunked under water in a river or lake or a tank is a crazy thing to do. It is the first act of obedience a Christian has opportunity for, to his/ her God. God has vested His very own Son, so that we might be saved and I believe He does all things that are possible to see that every individual on earth has every opportunity to recieve Salvation. Is basptism necessary for salvation? What do you do if you live in an area that has only ice or no water at all?

Wow, I have never met a person that could live without water! I wonder what these people you mention drink? Llama juice? If you find people you HAVE to find water because we kind of need it to live. It makes no difference if the water is piped in, trucked in, dug up provided from a lake or river, or in answer to your question above...melted. Where you find people you have to have a water source. (I say this in jest!)

Your opposition to baptism in water is not an opposition to those on this site. It is an opposition to God and his word (Mark 16:16 and Acts 2:38).

On the great day of Pentecost mentioned in Acts chapter 2, what did Peter tell the people to do who cried out?
Did he tell them to just say a prayer...no.
Did he tell them to confess Jesus in their heart....no.
Did he tell them to just live a good life....no.
Did he tell them to be baptized as an outward sign of an inward gift... no.
Did he tell them to be baptized because they were already saved...no.
He told them to repent and be baptized and by doing so they would have the remission of their sins (notice, they were still sinners) and the gift of the Holy Spirit (Acts 2:38). We will see the phrase "washing away your sins" in Acts 22:16 showing that Baptism is the moment when ones sins are removed, not before and not after...during.

Jesus told Nicodemus that two things were needed for a person to enter the Kingdom of heave...water and Spirit (John 3:5) We see both of these things in baptism. Water and Spirit come together.

You can argue against baptism all day long, but I'm going to side with what God has said. You have come to a site that will defend the necessity of baptism to the very end. We will not budge, we will not negotiate, we will not compromise and we most certainty will not belittle the command to be baptized.

If you want to learn the truth and be taught the word of God more accurately, you have come to the right site my friend. Open your Bible and join us in study.....

Kindly,
Don

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Don Gelles,
Preacher, Church of Christ in Hyde Park
Austin, Texas
www.hydeparkcoc.org

It did sound awfully yummy though!

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If we live in Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Gal. 5.25 NJKV

Your right... it did!

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Don Gelles,
Preacher, Church of Christ in Hyde Park
Austin, Texas
www.hydeparkcoc.org

I am not at all opposed to baptism. I've been baptized twice. The first time I got the top of my noggin done. The second time for the rest of me.
Mat 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water to repentance. But He who comes after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He shall baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire; says John the Baptist. Is it possible that a number of these verses refer to being baptised into something other than water? In the verse above it references baptism with Holy Spirit and fire. There is also a verse that speaks of being baptised into the Father, Son ,and Holy Spirit.
Just wondering

That's a good question! Give Ephesians 4:5 a read and lets talk about the "one baptism".

Kindly,
Don

__________________
Don Gelles,
Preacher, Church of Christ in Hyde Park
Austin, Texas
www.hydeparkcoc.org

I have read Ephesians 4:5. You make a good point. In the story of Apollos outlined in Acts 18:25 to Acts 19:6 there are two baptisms spoken of by Paul, the baptism of John (water baptism) and the baptism into Christ Jesus (into the Spirit of Christ/ Holy Spirit) Apollos has been baptised by John thru immersion already. Then Paul spoke to him and they were baptised into the name of the Lord Jesus. Now Apollos has been baptised twice. Act 19:4 And Paul said, John truly baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying to the people that they should believe into Him coming after him, that is, into Jesus Christ.
Act 19:5 And hearing, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. (MKJV)
There are two baptisms here. Which baptism do you believe is the one baptism spoken of by Paul in Ephesians 4:5, baptism in water or baptism into Him?

I am curious what translation you are using that says in Acts 19. 4 "that they should believe into Him coming after him,"

The NKJV says " He told the people to believe in the one coming after him,"

It does not say " believe into Him" !

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If we live in Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Gal. 5.25 NJKV

It is the modern King James Version (MKJV)

Cheers, Robbie.

Thanks Robert, I was just curious about the translation, because it puts a totally differant meaning to the verse. I have used the NASB for 40 years, and it says almost the same as the NKJV .
I do not believe the MKJV is accurate! ( I didn't even know there was a MKJV ! )

BTW, You can call me Marian.

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If we live in Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Gal. 5.25 NJKV

You are talking about the SAME baptism.

Water baptism and "being baptized in the name of Jesus" are the same. The one baptism of Ephesians 4:5 is water baptism.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit only occurred twice the the Bible: Acts 2:2-4(On the Apostles as Jesus had told them it would: John 16:13 / Acts 1:8) and Acts 10:44 (The household of Cornelius. We know that it was the same Holy Spirit Baptism that fell upon the Apostles because Peter says it was in Acts 11:15). We also know that Holy Spirit baptism did not have water as an element so there was the need for the Household of Cornelius to be baptized in water: 10:47. Now, why the water? because Jesus taught that for one to enter the Kingdom of heaven one must be born of water and Spirit (John 3:5). Where do we see water and Spirit coming together? Yep- at water baptism (Acts 2:38).

The one baptism of Ephesians 4:5 is thus understood through the scriptures as being water baptism.

Kindly,
Don

__________________
Don Gelles,
Preacher, Church of Christ in Hyde Park
Austin, Texas
www.hydeparkcoc.org

Your are correct... and thanks for the "atta boy"

The interesting thing about Matthew 3:11 and Luke 3:16 is that God is the one doing the baptizing.... not man.

__________________
Don Gelles,
Preacher, Church of Christ in Hyde Park
Austin, Texas
www.hydeparkcoc.org

Yes they were my brother. I can still smell that Honey Chicken! I will always love Pineville because it is where 1 Samuel 18:1 happened for me regarding you.

__________________
Don Gelles,
Preacher, Church of Christ in Hyde Park
Austin, Texas
www.hydeparkcoc.org

If the baptism by water and baptism of the into Jesus/Holy Spirit are the same, why would Apollos be baptised first by John (the baptist) and then again by Paul? Why be baptised twice.
In reference to John 3:5 if I may, is it possible that being born of water is the natural birth (from the womb) and born of the Spirit (or born from above) is the second birth.
Finally if there is only one baptism per Ephesians 4:5, by whose understanding is it the water baptism of John. John was the last great prophet of the Old Testament because the New Covenant had not been ratified by the blood of Jesus yet.
If you testify of yourselves and give each other then you bear witness to one another, however if you are seeing something new here, by the Holy Spirit then He bears witness to the Son and to inspired Scripture.